A Lawyer Explains: The Legal Reasons Why Mother 3 Will Never Be Localized in the West
A Lawyer Explains: The Legal Reasons Why Mother 3 Will Never Be Localized in the West
by Moonsight
22 Comments
Moonsight
Hi r/Nintendo! I’m a lawyer who has recently taken up video essaying as a hobby. You may have seen my other videos on this subreddit, concerning Nintendo’s “overprotectiveness” and Sega’s “under-protectiveness” when it comes to their respective intellectual properties. (Thank you, Mods!)
I love Mother 3 very deeply, and so wanted to explore the legal reasons I feel Mother 3 will never be localized in the West. We will explore some case law together, learn a little music theory, and then look at Mother 3 itself.
I sincerely hope that you will enjoy!
[deleted]
[deleted]
Moonsight
I saw someone else’s post regarding Earthbound having similar copyright troubles, but saw that it was deleted.
I wrote up an answer though, for your consideration:
The video does go into that! There’s a whole chapter on exactly this topic.
There’s a difference in the law between “sampling” and “tribute” — Earthbound uses a lot of sampling, but the samples fall into a legal loophole that I am certain Nintendo stumbled into accidentally: the samples are “de minimus” and “transformative.” Earthbound does have a few “tributes” as well, but these are older songs and are either easier to clear, or unnecessary to clear (for a few reasons).
Mother 3 doesn’t have that same protection!
bbressman2
I appreciate the insight that went into this, but I was sadly expecting an April fools troll where it just shows Reggie as the reason.
Placiibo
Hate the title of this video. Yeah, localization would have to change substantial sections of the game. It’s always been that way with localization! It has always been a Nintendo business decision to weigh the cost of the rework against potential returns. I believe Reggie when he calls it a business decision. Frankly, I think Nintendo actually hates all retro games from a profit standpoint. They want maximum money for gamer hours spent. If they drop a great GBA game on their service, that nobody has ever played, many will just play that over a new game. There are many new pixel based RPGs always hitting Switch that it would hurt. THAT is the reason. Its business, like Reggie said, NOT LEGAL.
TommyW-Unofficial
Dude that was so good. We need more academic eyes on the culture, thank you for your work
wh03v3r
Eh, if they wanted to bring the game to the West, it would have been the least of their problems to change the few songs that could cause them trouble ever so slightly to avoid a lawsuit. Its not the first time developers have changed music for international releases and the licalization process already requires altering the game’s code.
Sure, it doesn’t make the localization process any easier but we’re already talking about a game that is pretty difficult to localize to begin with. Some of the story beats that Nintendo may consider roo controversial for the West or too inappropriate to younger players seem like bigger hang-ups to me.
imlavanow
Realistically if this was gonna make money it would be out. As a Nintendo nerd I want to see it happen but I think this is a vocal minority situation. Like captain falcon and others, Ness and Lucas are essentially smash characters to most people
amin_rd
Really enjoyed the video. Still got two questions on my mind though…
1) I feel like Nintendo could easily get away with changing the most problematic songs. It wouldn’t be ideal, sure, but most fans would probably let it slide if it meant that the game would get a western release (which, side note, I don’t think can be said about changing up controversial story elements). Am I wrong for thinking this?
2) What about the Mother 3 song remixes in Smash Bros? Referring to Unfounded Revenge, You Call This a Utopia?! and Porky’s Theme (which includes the Enter the Pigmasks leitmotif). These don’t seem to hold back a western release for Smash, despite also including musical references?
Exiled_Emperor_
Yeah well I’m not gonna listen and hope
lordpugfart
I got banned from the Earthbound subreddit for mentioning how Lucas gets his powers are from getting felt up by one of the magypsies in a Cave. It’s a real plot point. It actually happen. The young protagonist essentially gets molested by a cross dresser. I figured it would not get officially released because of that.
Newtonjar
It is of no exaggeration that you have become my favorite creator. I enjoy your ability to distill complicated legal situations into their most understandable components while creating an interesting narrative. I am absolutely looking forward to what you do in the future.
Moving on to the subject of the video. I think it is absolutely backwards that sampling is more acceptable than homage. And going onto the subject the idea that homages aren’t allowed. I know that
The sampling has to be either short or transformative, but I feel like the idea of a good homage or reference is that it is inherently transformative. I do think the judges decisions on this subject is deeply mistaken and ignores the entirety of western classic tradition. Classical music is full of references to earlier pieces of music. And more than that full on inspiration. You can draw a continuous line from baroque to late romantic era of famous composers whose seminal works are directly inspired from a prior famous composer. (I’m sure you could draw a longer line but that is not my area of knowledge). These works are considered pieces of musical genius and are highly referential in nature. Although I think this is probably a cold take. But being a cold take why are these judges who are incredibly educated individuals disregarding this fact. To me it makes little sense. Of course people can still pay homage to old music, but that is hardly a fix. Music should be alive, artists should be able to have musical conversations with each other. Of course I am not a lawyer nor an expert in music so I don’t really know how much this impacts the quality of music, but I would argue that it could hardly be a good one.
I was wondering if you think that this precedent will hold for the foreseeable future. I would like to think that if it were to change then mother 3 would have a good chance of being released.
NinjaWorldWar
I’ve been following and watching each video you post! They are really good. Keep it up. Is their a fan patch for Mother 3?
LordCharco_iii
Don’t have time to watch the video right now so apologies if you say this in it: My take is that given how absolutely ruthless Nintendo have been about copyright in every other instance – Pokémon Uranium, AM2R, every single gaming music channel on YouTube, everything to do with emulation – the fact that the fan translation hasn’t received so much as a disapproving shake of the head is basically them giving their blessing to the project. We have our Mother 3, they don’t need to wade through fields of localization changes.
Of course I could be fully off the mark here, I cannot and should not speak for a massive globe-spanning corporation older than me, that’s just an assessment based on how they’ve been in the past.
wetdrizzle
I’ve enjoyed all of your videos so much! Thanks for the brilliant insight
uncreativemind2099
I doubt it’s any reason other that the creator being unwilling to release anywhere except Japan
Danny_Eddy
Nice video. I agree with you. I could see it being released on Japan’s NSO for GBA, but for a translation of it, that would be the first I could think of for them placing a new translation on the service, and it is even less likely there would be a full release unless it would be remastered in some way of which both would need to getvaround these legal hurdles to be localized in the west. Given Sega’s recent infamy for challenging songs in Sonic 3 for possibly legal reasons against Jackson’s estate, that seems like a battle Nintendo doesn’t want in court, both legal or public opinion.
I_Go_By_Q
Really cool video! Regarding the end bit, I don’t think it was “too legal” at all, I thought you did a great job of breaking down important concepts for us normies to understand, but at the same time, I’d be down to hear your thoughts on similar topics even if it doesn’t require as strong of a legal lens!
ghostpocket
What is this game and how do I play it? The art style is amazing.
VashTrigun78
This reminds me of another game that was released in the west, and consistently at that: Wild Arms is an RPG for the PlayStation that features a setting that is equal parts wild west and fantasy, with some sci-fi thrown in just for fun. The imagery, especially in later entries, evokes the spirit of the westerns that inspired it. Its soundtrack is of particular note – it’s totally stellar, and also evokes the spirit of Ennio Morricone’s music. In some instances, however, it goes beyond simple evocativeness. Wild Arms’ [Lone Bird in the Shire](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fSB-ea-8sRk) is the world map theme, and bears deep similarities to Morricone’s [The Ecstacy of Gold](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PYI09PMNazw) from The Good, the Bad and the Ugly. [It even got a remix in the remake, Alter Code F, that cranked up the similarities even further.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XHsPDJ-h6iE)
What’s strange to me is that Wild Arms has been a fairly consistent presence in Sony’s classics catalog. It appeared early on in their PlayStation Classics selection for the PS3 and PSP. It was included in their ill-conceived PlayStation Classic Console (their counterpart to the NES and SNES Classic consoles – real original name, I know). It also got a recent rerelease on PlayStation 4 and 5 through their updated classics collection.
What do you make of this? Is Sony just more daring than Nintendo? Are the similarities not as obvious? Is there an explanation?
BronzeHeart92
Eh, I doubt that would be the only reason. A more rational explanation could simply be that Mother 3 released at a time when Nintendo was already heavily invested into the DS and thus didn’t see value in localizing a game for a previous console. As far as the overall music situation goes, however, I could see it as a similar situation to Doom’s soundtrack that likewise contains plenty of samples, mainly from various notable metal tracks of the era (At Doom’s Gate being inspired by Metallica’s Master of Puppets for instance). Therefore it’s quite possible that Nintendo could have gotten away with releasing this game with minimal changes.
amboredentertainme
And this is a great example why emulation and romhacking matters, there are so many great games that were it not for emulation and fan translations us westerners would’ve never even know about them
22 Comments
Hi r/Nintendo! I’m a lawyer who has recently taken up video essaying as a hobby. You may have seen my other videos on this subreddit, concerning Nintendo’s “overprotectiveness” and Sega’s “under-protectiveness” when it comes to their respective intellectual properties. (Thank you, Mods!)
I love Mother 3 very deeply, and so wanted to explore the legal reasons I feel Mother 3 will never be localized in the West. We will explore some case law together, learn a little music theory, and then look at Mother 3 itself.
I sincerely hope that you will enjoy!
[deleted]
I saw someone else’s post regarding Earthbound having similar copyright troubles, but saw that it was deleted.
I wrote up an answer though, for your consideration:
The video does go into that! There’s a whole chapter on exactly this topic.
There’s a difference in the law between “sampling” and “tribute” — Earthbound uses a lot of sampling, but the samples fall into a legal loophole that I am certain Nintendo stumbled into accidentally: the samples are “de minimus” and “transformative.” Earthbound does have a few “tributes” as well, but these are older songs and are either easier to clear, or unnecessary to clear (for a few reasons).
Mother 3 doesn’t have that same protection!
I appreciate the insight that went into this, but I was sadly expecting an April fools troll where it just shows Reggie as the reason.
Hate the title of this video. Yeah, localization would have to change substantial sections of the game. It’s always been that way with localization! It has always been a Nintendo business decision to weigh the cost of the rework against potential returns. I believe Reggie when he calls it a business decision. Frankly, I think Nintendo actually hates all retro games from a profit standpoint. They want maximum money for gamer hours spent. If they drop a great GBA game on their service, that nobody has ever played, many will just play that over a new game. There are many new pixel based RPGs always hitting Switch that it would hurt. THAT is the reason. Its business, like Reggie said, NOT LEGAL.
Dude that was so good. We need more academic eyes on the culture, thank you for your work
Eh, if they wanted to bring the game to the West, it would have been the least of their problems to change the few songs that could cause them trouble ever so slightly to avoid a lawsuit. Its not the first time developers have changed music for international releases and the licalization process already requires altering the game’s code.
Sure, it doesn’t make the localization process any easier but we’re already talking about a game that is pretty difficult to localize to begin with. Some of the story beats that Nintendo may consider roo controversial for the West or too inappropriate to younger players seem like bigger hang-ups to me.
Realistically if this was gonna make money it would be out. As a Nintendo nerd I want to see it happen but I think this is a vocal minority situation. Like captain falcon and others, Ness and Lucas are essentially smash characters to most people
Really enjoyed the video. Still got two questions on my mind though…
1) I feel like Nintendo could easily get away with changing the most problematic songs. It wouldn’t be ideal, sure, but most fans would probably let it slide if it meant that the game would get a western release (which, side note, I don’t think can be said about changing up controversial story elements). Am I wrong for thinking this?
2) What about the Mother 3 song remixes in Smash Bros? Referring to Unfounded Revenge, You Call This a Utopia?! and Porky’s Theme (which includes the Enter the Pigmasks leitmotif). These don’t seem to hold back a western release for Smash, despite also including musical references?
Yeah well I’m not gonna listen and hope
I got banned from the Earthbound subreddit for mentioning how Lucas gets his powers are from getting felt up by one of the magypsies in a Cave. It’s a real plot point. It actually happen. The young protagonist essentially gets molested by a cross dresser. I figured it would not get officially released because of that.
It is of no exaggeration that you have become my favorite creator. I enjoy your ability to distill complicated legal situations into their most understandable components while creating an interesting narrative. I am absolutely looking forward to what you do in the future.
Moving on to the subject of the video. I think it is absolutely backwards that sampling is more acceptable than homage. And going onto the subject the idea that homages aren’t allowed. I know that
The sampling has to be either short or transformative, but I feel like the idea of a good homage or reference is that it is inherently transformative. I do think the judges decisions on this subject is deeply mistaken and ignores the entirety of western classic tradition. Classical music is full of references to earlier pieces of music. And more than that full on inspiration. You can draw a continuous line from baroque to late romantic era of famous composers whose seminal works are directly inspired from a prior famous composer. (I’m sure you could draw a longer line but that is not my area of knowledge). These works are considered pieces of musical genius and are highly referential in nature. Although I think this is probably a cold take. But being a cold take why are these judges who are incredibly educated individuals disregarding this fact. To me it makes little sense. Of course people can still pay homage to old music, but that is hardly a fix. Music should be alive, artists should be able to have musical conversations with each other. Of course I am not a lawyer nor an expert in music so I don’t really know how much this impacts the quality of music, but I would argue that it could hardly be a good one.
I was wondering if you think that this precedent will hold for the foreseeable future. I would like to think that if it were to change then mother 3 would have a good chance of being released.
I’ve been following and watching each video you post! They are really good. Keep it up. Is their a fan patch for Mother 3?
Don’t have time to watch the video right now so apologies if you say this in it: My take is that given how absolutely ruthless Nintendo have been about copyright in every other instance – Pokémon Uranium, AM2R, every single gaming music channel on YouTube, everything to do with emulation – the fact that the fan translation hasn’t received so much as a disapproving shake of the head is basically them giving their blessing to the project. We have our Mother 3, they don’t need to wade through fields of localization changes.
Of course I could be fully off the mark here, I cannot and should not speak for a massive globe-spanning corporation older than me, that’s just an assessment based on how they’ve been in the past.
I’ve enjoyed all of your videos so much! Thanks for the brilliant insight
I doubt it’s any reason other that the creator being unwilling to release anywhere except Japan
Nice video. I agree with you. I could see it being released on Japan’s NSO for GBA, but for a translation of it, that would be the first I could think of for them placing a new translation on the service, and it is even less likely there would be a full release unless it would be remastered in some way of which both would need to getvaround these legal hurdles to be localized in the west. Given Sega’s recent infamy for challenging songs in Sonic 3 for possibly legal reasons against Jackson’s estate, that seems like a battle Nintendo doesn’t want in court, both legal or public opinion.
Really cool video! Regarding the end bit, I don’t think it was “too legal” at all, I thought you did a great job of breaking down important concepts for us normies to understand, but at the same time, I’d be down to hear your thoughts on similar topics even if it doesn’t require as strong of a legal lens!
What is this game and how do I play it? The art style is amazing.
This reminds me of another game that was released in the west, and consistently at that: Wild Arms is an RPG for the PlayStation that features a setting that is equal parts wild west and fantasy, with some sci-fi thrown in just for fun. The imagery, especially in later entries, evokes the spirit of the westerns that inspired it. Its soundtrack is of particular note – it’s totally stellar, and also evokes the spirit of Ennio Morricone’s music. In some instances, however, it goes beyond simple evocativeness. Wild Arms’ [Lone Bird in the Shire](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fSB-ea-8sRk) is the world map theme, and bears deep similarities to Morricone’s [The Ecstacy of Gold](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PYI09PMNazw) from The Good, the Bad and the Ugly. [It even got a remix in the remake, Alter Code F, that cranked up the similarities even further.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XHsPDJ-h6iE)
There are other instances of this too, such as Wild Arms’ [Agitation to Destruction](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0usroRVvfpg) lifting a melody from [Farewell Cheyenne](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iM8x3lKXetw), from Once Upon a Time in the West.
What’s strange to me is that Wild Arms has been a fairly consistent presence in Sony’s classics catalog. It appeared early on in their PlayStation Classics selection for the PS3 and PSP. It was included in their ill-conceived PlayStation Classic Console (their counterpart to the NES and SNES Classic consoles – real original name, I know). It also got a recent rerelease on PlayStation 4 and 5 through their updated classics collection.
What do you make of this? Is Sony just more daring than Nintendo? Are the similarities not as obvious? Is there an explanation?
Eh, I doubt that would be the only reason. A more rational explanation could simply be that Mother 3 released at a time when Nintendo was already heavily invested into the DS and thus didn’t see value in localizing a game for a previous console. As far as the overall music situation goes, however, I could see it as a similar situation to Doom’s soundtrack that likewise contains plenty of samples, mainly from various notable metal tracks of the era (At Doom’s Gate being inspired by Metallica’s Master of Puppets for instance). Therefore it’s quite possible that Nintendo could have gotten away with releasing this game with minimal changes.
And this is a great example why emulation and romhacking matters, there are so many great games that were it not for emulation and fan translations us westerners would’ve never even know about them